Gay Rights and The Vice Presidential Debate
Last night, during the vice- presidential debate the topic of same-sex marriage was raised. Now I know that during these elections, all of gay rights seems to be boiled down to this one question: Do you or don’t you support same-sex marriage? When you put it as simplistically as that, there seems to be no difference between the candidates. And listening to their answers, it’s hard not to feel insulted and hurt. In case you missed the debate, here is a transcript of what was said:
GWEN IFILL: Senator Biden. Do you support, as they do in Alaska, granting same-sex benefits to couples?During the debate, I got a text message from a friend. She said, "How did you like getting thrown under the bus? I’m not voting for either of these fools!"BIDEN: Absolutely. Do I support granting same-sex benefits? Absolutely positively. Look, in an Obama-Biden administration, there will be absolutely no distinction from a constitutional standpoint or a legal standpoint between a same-sex and a heterosexual couple.
The fact of the matter is that under the Constitution we should be granted -- same-sex couples should be able to have visitation rights in the hospitals, joint ownership of property, life insurance policies, et cetera. That's only fair.
It's what the Constitution calls for. And so we do support it. We do support making sure that committed couples in a same-sex marriage are guaranteed the same constitutional benefits as it relates to their property rights, their rights of visitation, their rights to insurance, their rights of ownership as heterosexual couples do.
IFILL: Governor, would you support expanding that beyond Alaska to the rest of the nation?
PALIN: Well, not if it goes closer and closer towards redefining the traditional definition of marriage between one man and one woman. And unfortunately that's sometimes where those steps lead.
But I also want to clarify, if there's any kind of suggestion at all from my answer that I would be anything but tolerant of adults in America choosing their partners, choosing relationships that they deem best for themselves, you know, I am tolerant and I have a very diverse family and group of friends and even within that group you would see some who may not agree with me on this issue, some very dear friends who don't agree with me on this issue.
But in that tolerance also, no one would ever propose, not in a McCain-Palin administration, to do anything to prohibit, say, visitations in a hospital or contracts being signed, negotiated between parties.
But I will tell Americans straight up that I don't support defining marriage as anything but between one man and one woman, and I think through nuances we can go round and round about what that actually means.
But I'm being as straight up with Americans as I can in my non- support for anything but a traditional definition of marriage.
IFILL: Let's try to avoid nuance, Senator. Do you support gay marriage?
BIDEN: No. Barack Obama nor I support redefining from a civil side what constitutes marriage. We do not support that. That is basically the decision to be able to be able to be left to faiths and people who practice their faiths the determination what you call it. The bottom line though is, and I'm glad to hear the governor, I take her at her word, obviously, that she think there should be no civil rights distinction, none whatsoever, between a committed gay couple and a committed heterosexual couple. If that's the case, we really don't have a difference.
IFILL: Is that what your said?
PALIN: Your question to him was whether he supported gay marriage and my answer is the same as his and it is that I do not.
Seriously? Does the whole election boil down to this one issue? She’s not the first person I’ve heard express this sentiment. People have been saying they’re not going to VOTE for either candidate, because neither supports same-sex marriage. Do you agree or disagree with these people? Is the issue of same-sex marriage THAT important to you that you withhold voting at all? And is that really going to send a message to anyone? What about the other issues of importance to gays and lesbians, like Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell, Employment Non-Discrimination and Hate Crimes Legislation?
What about universal American issues, like health care reform, the war and the economy? Aren't these issues worth casting a vote for? Add your thoughts in the comments section below.
© Photo by Don Emmert/Getty Images
Let’s be real people! No viable candidate at this point in time can utter the words, “I support gay marriage.” They could possibly lose the election because of that. The truth is that through actions we can see where the candidates really stand. In California, where I am going to marry my partner of 10 1/2 years next week, a Yes vote on Proposition 8 is a vote to end gay marriage. McCain has publicly come out in favor of it and Obama has publicly come out against it. Anyone who says the candidates are the same isn’t paying attention, or doesn’t have anything to lose by who gets into office. I feel I have a lot to lose if McCain is elected which is why I wholeheartedly support Obama.
I can’t believe gay people when they say they won’t support either candidate because neither support gay marriage. Palin believes being gay is a “choice”. She’s said that more than once. Obama calls us “gay and lesbian brothers and sisters”. Obama is FOR civial unions, that’s WAY more than you’re going to get from the Republican party, no matter what they say now. Democrats usually support civial unions for gay couples. It’s NOT the same as marriage, but it’s a START. Like KK said, McCain said YES to Proposition 8 and Obama said NO. A YES would END gay marriage in California. OBAMA has said he believes marriage should be between and man and a women, but that he believe it should be up to the STATE and that he will not make gay marriage illegal. McCain WILL make gay marriage illegal. And regardless of what the state decides on gay marriage, Obama will give us civial unions. Will the Republican’s? Fat chance.
It’s hard to believe gay people won’t vote because neither canidate “supports gay marriage”. One will make it illegal, one won’t. One will give us civial unions, the other won’t. And what about Sarah Palin and her ex-gay church? It’s sad thinking we’ll loose a Obama vote just because of gay marriage.
As far as the debate went, I wasn’t shocked that both said they didn’t support gay marriage. But what about the other gay issues? I’m tired of hearing that gays “choose” to be gay, as much of the Republican party tends to think. At least the Democratic party is taking STEPS to equal rights.
I think we all have the right to marry, but i dont think nationally laws are going to change anytime soon. Gay marriage is a touchy subject. I would love to marry my partner someday, but I may never be able to. However, there are other issues I am concerned with such as the economy, education, discrimination, and the war. Gay marriage is just a part of the election – not the whole election. Obama stands for what I stand for – therefore he has my vote – for or against gay marriage.
If you listen/read carefully, Biden said that while he and Obama don’t support “Gay marriage”, they do support EQUALITY. He said that they think the definition of marriage should be up to the church, not the govt. He said that we should all have the same rights from a legal standpoint. My partner and I have had the ceremony, and from our and our family’s points of view, we are married. Now we are fighting for the same LEGAL rights. I don’t care what they call it…just don’t deny me because I love and share my life with the same sex. It’s ridiculous to make such a drastic decision as NOT voting because of one issue that will not change in this election.
i didnt see the debate but after reading this.. its heartbreaking. neither one of them supported it thats terrible. and though obama said he supports equality thats nice but it doesnt make up for not legally letting us marry. it seems he kept saying the same thing over and over, in a different order each time. until he finally gave a straight answer.
I also hate that neither canidate supports gay marriage. I also have to look at the bigger picture. This is not about just me and what i want. I have to look at what is best for this country. Legal marriage for us is very important, but health care and stopping this war is much more important. So I have to go with Obama because he is only one that has said anything about doing either.
I sent that text. Yes, I will vote for Obama, but I am so SICK and TIRED of gay marriage being seen as SO controversial that no one dare support it. Come to Massachusetts and see just how boring married gay folk are. I had a reaction to being dismissed not once but three times by my party. I don’t expect anything from McCain- but when will MY party recognize me?
I do absolutely understand the frustration of my party, the Democrats, not supporting me. I’ve been, in the past, a campaign worker for candidates who are happy to use gay money and time, but aren’t so happy to step forward in defense of our civil rights. It has been slowly changing for the better over the last few years (emphasis on “slowly”).
Having said that, though, I must stress that I cannot under any circumstances be a single issue voter. My son leaves for Iraq in two weeks. My daughter has no health care (but would have had it under the SCHIP expansion, had that passed). I work for a struggling small business and am one paycheck away from donning a blue vest and a smile whilst memorizing the phrase “Welcome to Wal-Mart!” There is far too much at stake for me to cast my vote for anyone but Obama.
Just as with any other repressed minority, it is not just the responsibility of the oppressor to cease and desist, but also the oppressed to let go of the issues that define their oppression and move on to other more universally defined human issues. I agree if we pivot on one issue, such as same sex marriage, we lose our grasp on our goal of true and complete participation in society at all levels. I think gay rights has moved to the place that we make the most headway by EXPECTING acceptance, BEHAVING as if it has already happened, and then RESPONDING as if those who do not accept us are as simply annoying and out of place as a mosquito. When we participate fully in the democratic process, without hiding, then we are fully a member, and those who have a problem are those who have a problem. Not us.
I agree with LC in saying it’s a start!! Although I’m not happy regarding their stand on gay marriage….equality is a start. Everything takes time, this is just taking a little more. We HAVE to vote to have our voices heard, I have learned this only in the past few years. I used to not vote because I thought that my 1 little vote wouldn’t matter…and although everytime I vote my choice has not won, I still vote….someday my voice WILL be heard, along with many others…..PLEASE VOTE YOUR VOICE NEEDS TO BE HEARD!!!
Let’s be clear here, this election is terribly important so we can’t throw our votes away. While Obama and Biden do not overtly support gay marriage, we have to understand that at this junction, they cannot. We need to elect them for other reasons, such as getting rid of DOMA, Don’t Ask Don’t Tell and creating a Gender-inclusive ENDA. This is why I am voting with the Democratic party instead of the Libertarian Party which I support.
Barr may be a candidate that would shake this nation up in a very postive way, but let’s be completely honest here, he hasn’t a snowball’s chance in hell of winning. McCain and Palin would most definitely weaken existing hate-crimes laws and they have been talking about putting a constitutional limitation on marriage. We cannot have this either!
Yes, I definitely will be voting for Obama, simply because he at least supports us having rights, which is a much bigger step than anyone else is willing to do. He will also give us the chance of possibly having a civil union, which is more than we have the option of doing now, and make it where our state would have to recognize it. I’m all for that. They have also said that they are for passing the 1100+ federal privileges that married couples get on to same-sex couples, which leads me to believe that that means they’re working on a national-level union of some sort.
In my opinion, I don’t care what they call it, if it gives us the same rights. Union, marriage, whatever, it doesn’t matter to me, I’ll still be ‘married’ to my partner either way.
In my case, I would be happy to have a ceremony with my partner now, but she feels it would mean that much more if we could do it and it be legal as well, and recognized here in our state, so until we get some type of legal recognition here in our state, we’re not having a ceremony. With McCain in office, that could be another 4-8 years. With Obama, it could be _within_ the next 4 years, and to me, that’s a big deal, considering we have a 2-year-old we’re raising together.
Well, I was very hurt by this little moment during the debate. In fact, I had to walk out of the room to cool off.
I am still going to vote, but this certainly cooled off any true support I had. No, it doesn’t all come down to this one issue, but I hate that gays and lesbians are being used as the last group people come together over hating. It’s ridiculous, insulting, hateful, and just plain stupid.
I also wish that we could just have someone that doesn’t preach hate and separation in our country running for office.
I don’t want to vote for either of them. What if those of us who feel this way, “write in” on the ballot Hillary Clinton?!?
It has been said several times above, but u know, baby steps. Do I wish people would stop treating me and those like me differently? Of course. I would love to have a president who is completely for gay marriage and gay rights? Hell yeah. But it is gonna take time. Tiny, baby steps towards whats right and just. Atleast Obama and Biden are open to the idea of treating us like more than second class citizens.
And, if u decide not to vote, you lose all right to get upset and complain about any and all politics that happen. Because you chose not to even try and voice your opinion.
Plus, Obama is for expanding the Hate Crime statutes. They are proposing the Mathew Shepard Act. That alone is worth my vote
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My mother asked me how I felt as a lesbian about Joe Biden’s position on gay marriage. I told her that I knew Obama did not support gay marriage. Anyone who vistited Obama’s website (or view his HRC report card)would be able to see where he very clearly states he believes marriage is between man and woman. Does that mean I am not voting for him? Absolutely not. I prefer to be treated with respect and to be told straight up, like he has, that although he does not support gay marriage, he does support EQUALITY and he would allow each state to decide. I know the right thing would be to have a candidate who supports gay marriage, but lets not be haste. Change is coming!!!
I don’t really care if we can “get married” and being gay isn’t traditional anyway so why be “traditional”. We should be able to have some sort of Union or something that verifies we are committed and be given the same rights and protections under the law same as a “married” couple. I think that gay people stay committed more so than straight couples anyway. Haven’t we seen more divorces amongst them versus us? I also believe that when gay people have children together it shouldn’t matter how long you have been broken up to file for standing of visitation rights. Does a father or mother of a child have these rules in the hedro world? The answer to that would be “no” but if your gay and your partner leaves you with the child you have grown to love and nuture as if they were your own child. You only have 90 days to file for standing. It’s crap because if your ex partner tells you they will never keep the child from you, trust me its all good until they find another partner and then they remove you from the child’s life that you have grown to love and supported. It’s pure devastation and I’m tired of the gay community using hedro rights when its convinent. Why do gays not stick together for equal rights? We are suppose to fighting against discrimination for all not just when it works for you.
If you don’t vote then you have no reason to be upset when things don’t work out.
it seems no one picked up on palin’s response to the question about gay marriage. in reality, they don’t agree. biden is in favor of setting up some sort of civil union system. palin wants to let them “enter into contracts,” i.e., the status quo, where a gay person has to hire a lawyer and spend THOUSANDS of dollars to get the same protections married heterosexuals have. such bull. and the moderator didn’t pick up on it. and apparently neither did the press.